I recieved a letter from the DNR This morning in the mail. It said there was random selecting from waterfowlers who purchased 2013 migratory game bird fee. Seems someone has taken special notice to an early teal season in Iowa. It says to fill out the survey of questions and return by march 1st. I know exactly what I will say. extended days of waterfowling in my opinion is a no brainer. I urge anyone who recieves this survey to fill it out and send back. Do your part as a waterfowler who cares, regardless of your opinion. Thanks
Early teal season survey.
1 reading
nlienau
21 - 40 of 234 Posts
Joined
·
1,914 Posts
I think that is going to be a recipe to kill the whole thing.
Joined
·
2,256 Posts
If you think polling everyone is going to help out late season hunters or your agenda you're still blind to the fact that you are the minority. I know you would not like the results from one of those that asked all waterfowlers when they wanted to hunt because I think that would really point out AGAIN just like the random surveys have the majority want earlier before freeze up dates to hunt and late season hunters are in a small group by themselves but something tells me you would criticize that data as well if it didn't fall into your way of thinking.
Hell random survey polls already have showed this but it wasn't believed so now you want to ask everyone, great idea too bad later season hunters will fall on the short end of the issues again. Careful what you wish for you might just get it......
Joined
·
2,256 Posts
Hell I've been asking them for years to just put up an online survey even though I know the data would not be highly regarded due to the facts of proven online survey flaws, but I told them if nothing else it would shut up the guys who didn't know any better and they could go back to calling the DNR lazy for not interrupting the data the way they think it should be.
Joined
·
2,256 Posts
The last poll that was taken a few years ago showed the vast majority of waterfowlers didn't even use or have the internet or hang out on hunting related forums.
Joined
·
14,103 Posts
Yep. Put a split in there and end in late January.:lol:
The vast majority of "old" waterfowlers (that responded to the survey)didn't "use or have....".
I guess I have two additional points to think of when considering online surveying:
1) "Younger" people are much less likely to fill out a survey and return than the older generations. Everything they've done their entire life has been electronically submitted - I'm guessing they have the data, but I'd think return rate from 28-under waterfowlers is much less than 50+.
2) Online surveys WILL be implemented in the future for many reasons - the biggest I'd think are reach and cost. So, why not at least get the ball rolling? The "reach" is the biggest thing, IMO. Hell - I had 3-400 surveys returned in less than 2 weeks regarding the new zone - all electronic and word of mouth. I realize that's not statistically valid, but either they want "hunter input" or they don't.
Many (maybe most) states in the midwest are aggressively expanding online options through surveys, requests, input, mapping and license purchasing - why is Iowa so insistent on fighting it?
Joined
·
2,256 Posts
Morning Gude,
I agree this issue is resolving itself as once the baby boomers keep retiring from hunting and all those who feel they are too old to learn new technology retire this problem with resolve itself. I am sure it is hard for younger folks to believe there are people who don't get online, text, facebook, etc etc. Working in the IT field for the last 15 years, I work with them daily.....
I understand the techno generation thing, but I have found through my experience, you can lead a duck to water but you can't make him land.
Older folks, especially ones that have been dedicated take the time because they are seeing and have been a part of the demise of their sport and finally get the true meaning about what waterfowling has MEANT to them, you provide everyone that passion, you will get responses no matter what the issue.
If its like last surveys, shit they even give you an addressed envelop with a stamp on it, if someone is too lazy to fill it out and drop it in the mail, whats the chances its a priority to, register for an account, filling all the data and hit send, I understand it easier but is this really about easy. I'm with you we got to start sometime, I am sure they talk with others about how there systems work etc maybe its not as beneficial and only raises more questions. I too have been preaching for years but I just don't have faith we gonna like the answers that come out of that system but your right it is a start but do others really understand that.
I also think hunter input is very different than statistical scientific surveys. Hunter input should be gathered 24x7 continually.
I feel there should always be an easy way to voice your concern to the powers that be and get a response in a responsible time frame which has always seemed to be via email and not the most rewarding system.
As I have asked before and it then grows silent, has anyone asked up the chain of the IDNR, we always seem to generalize when we blame the IDNR/waterfowl folks but maybe the finger pointing should be put in the right place and then pressure put there. Remember how many staff the waterfowl headquarters has so when extra staff is needed to help compile data or put together online surveys or the DNR webmaster to design it and servers to host it, a request has to go somewhere up the chain for approval how do you know they haven't been asking for it for years? Someone needs to ask where it sits on anyone's priority list. But why do that, its much easier for most to sit on here all day and call people lazy and bitch and moan than it is to pick up the phone and find the fuck out for real and try and make things happen. I remember Guy looking me square in the eyes and telling me we would never get those goose season dates moved back anytime soon but guess what, we did it with the help of many...
I don't disagree with anything you said, but I maintain that online development SHOULD be a priority for them (as it benefits the DNR and hunters). It will vastly cut down on costs long term and greatly increase their reach, flexibility, response rates, communication, feedback etc.
Joined
·
2,198 Posts
Tom
I think you are confused as I don't think I've ever said we need to poll all the waterfowlers in this state as it is:
A. Not needed
B. Would waste a lot of money
My main thinking is the use of online survey's to go along with the mail survey's to help save the IDNR money. What would you rather have? $10,000 spend on sending out a mail survey only or $5,000 for a combined mail and online survey and use that $5,000 on habitat...........
The great thing about online survey's is that they calculate all the results with ease so you don't have to sit their waiting for a machine to read each survey. (I'm assuming with the IDNR survey's, they are counted like basic skills, SAT, etc, or atleast I hope so)
I know that we "internet waterfowlers" are a minority or those that want "later seasons" but if we are the one's voicing our opinions, it should weigh alittle more in the eyes of the IDNR. But I think many of us are ashamed of what happened with the Missouri Zone and have turned a "bad eye" to the IDNR & NRC.
I hope the new biologist will gain our trust back because to improve waterfowl hunting in Iowa, they need more input from those that spend the most time in the marsh/field The Hunter and not some biologist, office clerk or conversation officer.
And stating that a few year's ago the majority of duck hunters didn't use the internet, forums etc, is in the past and things change Mr. Tom.
Doing an online survey will more then likely get more input from the younger generation of waterfowlers but isn't that a good thing? Don't we want to get input from those that will be duck hunting for 40+ more years or a guy in there 60's that is going to hunt for another 10 years?
I could see the above being both positive & negative because we all know that as you go thru the life as a duck hunter, you change how you feel about the sport, or atleast I hope someone does in relation to what is most important for success.
I have not asked the IDNR about their thoughts on internet survey's but will do so to see what they say as far as the positives and negatives. But I look at what you stated with the later goose dates, Zenner said it would never happen and look at what we have now and a lot of us are thankful for that opportunity.
It's just like Teal-Only, larger Missouri Zone, more opportunity in Dec, some will say it will never happen but if those that believe in it, keep fighting for it, it will become a reality. If not, this state is a shame!
Alright, I need to go smell some bleach & clean house after that typing
I think you are confused as I don't think I've ever said we need to poll all the waterfowlers in this state as it is:
A. Not needed
B. Would waste a lot of money
My main thinking is the use of online survey's to go along with the mail survey's to help save the IDNR money. What would you rather have? $10,000 spend on sending out a mail survey only or $5,000 for a combined mail and online survey and use that $5,000 on habitat...........
The great thing about online survey's is that they calculate all the results with ease so you don't have to sit their waiting for a machine to read each survey. (I'm assuming with the IDNR survey's, they are counted like basic skills, SAT, etc, or atleast I hope so)
I know that we "internet waterfowlers" are a minority or those that want "later seasons" but if we are the one's voicing our opinions, it should weigh alittle more in the eyes of the IDNR. But I think many of us are ashamed of what happened with the Missouri Zone and have turned a "bad eye" to the IDNR & NRC.
I hope the new biologist will gain our trust back because to improve waterfowl hunting in Iowa, they need more input from those that spend the most time in the marsh/field The Hunter and not some biologist, office clerk or conversation officer.
And stating that a few year's ago the majority of duck hunters didn't use the internet, forums etc, is in the past and things change Mr. Tom.
Doing an online survey will more then likely get more input from the younger generation of waterfowlers but isn't that a good thing? Don't we want to get input from those that will be duck hunting for 40+ more years or a guy in there 60's that is going to hunt for another 10 years?
I could see the above being both positive & negative because we all know that as you go thru the life as a duck hunter, you change how you feel about the sport, or atleast I hope someone does in relation to what is most important for success.
I have not asked the IDNR about their thoughts on internet survey's but will do so to see what they say as far as the positives and negatives. But I look at what you stated with the later goose dates, Zenner said it would never happen and look at what we have now and a lot of us are thankful for that opportunity.
It's just like Teal-Only, larger Missouri Zone, more opportunity in Dec, some will say it will never happen but if those that believe in it, keep fighting for it, it will become a reality. If not, this state is a shame!
Alright, I need to go smell some bleach & clean house after that typing
Joined
·
2,256 Posts
In all that BS I posted there is a ditto somewhere, the channel of communication gates need to be opened.
Joined
·
1,914 Posts
I would put the "older generation" line at about 50 and sadly a lot higher percentage of those hunters will probably still be hunting in 10 years than the 30 and under "younger generation".
Joined
·
2,198 Posts
If that is true TH, than the sport of waterfowl hunting in Iowa will continue to go down hill if there isn't the young out there supporting the sport. And like you said, that will be sad.
What makes you believe that? Cost of the Sport, Not Enough Time, etc, etc.
In general, I'd say that "younger generation" is the ones that are more welling to go to the extremes to hunt ducks in muddy, snowy, cold conditions over the "older generation" Or am I wrong?
Luckily for me, the majority of my hunting is done with the "older generation" and they know that fighting the mud, snow and cold is worth it. The young generation also have the same thoughts that hunt with me so now matter what, I'm good to go :lol:
Joined
·
1,914 Posts
Jobs, marriage, kids, and divorce will take out a good percentage of the younger guys. A large percentage of the young guys that talk about their wife or girlfriend "letting them" hunt this weekend will end up divorced, chasing tail, and paying child support or stay married and quit hunting because it's not worth the hassle. Then the kids hit third grade and have sporting events to go to 12 months of the year while your job piles on the overtime. Hunting loses priority status pretty quickly.
Joined
·
6,742 Posts
That is where you would be wrong. You see the teal season will be statewide. point period. Now for zones you have a choice in how you wish to structure your season. You can keep it the way it is and all you get are some teal season days out of the deal or you can open your season back up on the traditional second segment opener. Run it for 7 days shut it down for 5 and run it out to the last week end. You pick up 5 days later than you do now but you also get those X number of early teal season days. In total the early guys still get more days early and dont lose nothing.
Hell half the time an extra few days at the end for a lot of folks would make their entire season.
I know it can be done it just depends on how you boys want to play with your split option. You can with a teal season option. You dont have to however change a thing. But I would say this much. If you dont take advantage of the teal season option and the added ability to use your split where it is needed, your insane. You might be missing a few genes from a full table.
You can work the dates to get the season to close on a week end giving guys and gals an added week end of opportunity vs the close during the week BS.
Joined
·
3,499 Posts
Why would the vast majority of watefowlers not do an online survey? Where are you receiving this data?
Why would it be less statistically accurate? Your saying things but not backing them up with anything. Its word vomit.
Joined
·
4,710 Posts
Tom pretty much laid it out for you. I know its hard to grasp, it was tough for me a few years back. You don't need all to participate to get an acurrate reading. I'm still not exactly sure how that works but I'll take the stat guys word for it. Some of it is where and who it is sent to knowing the region they hunt and how often they purchase licenses and all that good stuff. A big portion of it is cost, but in this day and age, the online or email style survey will become the norm at some point
Joined
·
2,485 Posts
What did he say to possibly change your mind?
Joined
·
1,761 Posts
Obama wants a teal season?
Joined
·
14,103 Posts
It was more of how he said it.
21 - 40 of 234 Posts
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
